tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post727482910068536879..comments2023-10-21T05:40:55.660-04:00Comments on man with black hat: They Labor In Vain Who Build ItDavid L Alexanderhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-55760319665968634642008-05-27T14:39:00.000-04:002008-05-27T14:39:00.000-04:00Just singling out your comment about the episode i...Just singling out your comment about the episode involving St. Ambrose and Emperor Theodosius, Father Zuhlsdorf recently did an enlightening podcast on it:<BR/><BR/>http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/04/podcazt-54-pro-abortion-politicians-and-communion-st-ambrose-and-emperor-theodosius/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-489627711308744442008-05-23T13:51:00.000-04:002008-05-23T13:51:00.000-04:00The two bright spots for me were Cardinal Egan's c...The two bright spots for me were Cardinal Egan's censure of Giuliani, and your story about Saint Ambrose's interception of Emperor Theodosius. As I recall, the Emperor's penance was a trifle more than three Hail Marys too.Pertinacious Papisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03213911570586726075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-80754994034517457432008-05-23T09:10:00.000-04:002008-05-23T09:10:00.000-04:00Thanks for this post, my friend, although it's qui...Thanks for this post, my friend, although it's quite a depressing state-of-affairs, I must admit.Pertinacious Papisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03213911570586726075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-65946579369943984352008-05-15T11:05:00.000-04:002008-05-15T11:05:00.000-04:00One or two? That many???Including those readers I ...<I>One or two? That many???</I><BR/><BR/>Including those readers I deign to send you from my own blogroll. <BR/><BR/>Now, if you'll excuse me, I have a cigar to smoke and some honored guests to grovel before -- excuse me, attend to. <BR/><BR/>Cordials anyone? ;-)Christopher Blosserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08385159494196923575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-53884938873197698002008-05-15T10:54:00.000-04:002008-05-15T10:54:00.000-04:00"(I'll wager if your blog went silent, at least on...<I>"(I'll wager if your blog went silent, at least one or two readers would email Shea with an inquiry if he's heard anything)."</I><BR/><BR/>One or two? That many???David L Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-26942068727389631442008-05-15T10:50:00.000-04:002008-05-15T10:50:00.000-04:00... Mark Shea was actually getting e-mails from pe...<I>... Mark Shea was actually getting e-mails from people wanting to know where Amy was. Oh, yeah, like he and Amy and Gerald and Jimmy have this private penthouse in Manhattan where they smoke cigars (the guys, anyway) and drink cordials and conspire over the eventual iron-fisted rule of their corner of cyberspace. Geeeezzz...</I><BR/><BR/>One might conclude from this that "all readers of popular blogs are celebrity worshippers" who go into withdrawal the moment their blog stops posting.<BR/><BR/>On the other hand, over the course of 'St. Blog's' existence a "popular" blog may suddenly silent for some time only to discover that said author has had a health crisis. <BR/><BR/>I could point to Gerald Serafin (http://blogforlovers.blogspot.com/), who posted daily, whose blog went silent and we learned he passed away a few days later. <BR/><BR/>I could point to Karen Marie Knapp, another long-time blogger who passed away (again, as I recall, people learned of her death via Mark Shea).<BR/><BR/>I could point to this past week's example of Dale Price and his stint in the hospital, which many people read about at Mark Shea's (where his wife relayed the prayer request).<BR/><BR/>The likely reason people email Mark Shea when Amy Welborn's blog suddenly went silent? -- he's a blogger with a fairly wide readership and by that token alone, a likely conduit of news. It's not the first time familial members of bloggers have known to contact him with prayer requests or unfortunate news. <BR/><BR/>(I'll wager if your blog went silent, at least one or two readers would email Shea with an inquiry if he's heard anything).<BR/><BR/>But then, this is only speculation on my part why (gasp!) "Mark Shea was actually getting e-mails from people wanting to know where Amy was." Much easier to engage in some histrionics.Christopher Blosserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08385159494196923575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-28537242282209431112008-05-15T08:48:00.000-04:002008-05-15T08:48:00.000-04:00Thanks, Mark. By the way, I get better. There was ...Thanks, Mark. By the way, I get better. There was a time Ms Welborn shut down to go on vacation with her family for several days. If you felt the earth move last August, this might explain it:<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://manwithblackhat.blogspot.com/2007/08/my-amy-welborn-moment.html" REL="nofollow"><B>My Amy Welborn Moment</B></A><BR/><BR/><I>"Mark Shea was actually getting e-mails from people wanting to know where Amy was. Oh, yeah, like he and Amy and Gerald and Jimmy have this private penthouse in Manhattan where they smoke cigars (the guys, anyway) and drink cordials and conspire over the eventual iron-fisted rule of their corner of cyberspace. Geeeezzz..."</I>David L Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-74098573948427203872008-05-14T15:33:00.000-04:002008-05-14T15:33:00.000-04:00Thank you Mr. Alexander for the post gratuitously ...Thank you Mr. Alexander for the post gratuitously praising my own post.<BR/><BR/>Christopher,<BR/>While worship and making of idols is indeed hyperbolic to an extent, there is something grossly wrong when several blogs have to come out and say, "It pains me to remove so and so from my blogroll because of yada." Some of these posts are as bad as the "I'm leaving the Church for x" variety. A relationship where one party is more emotionally invested and pursues the other party is often called stalking. It is interesting that the argument has taken the turn it has, because a certain part of the indignity is people acting like Gerald was some sort of an authority and they had a role in making him such. Gerald is a layman. In no sense of the word is his influencial. I'd bet dollars to donuts that local and regional chairs of the Knights of Columbus have made some pretty ridiculous statements. The world didn't stop turning then. This issue is really not that important, and I really don't see why people think it needs to be important. Well actually I can. Some people's own self importance might be undermined if we learned that the most popular Catholic blogger made heretical statements and the rest of the world didn't take notice. It wasn't like it this is only topic he has deviated from Church teaching. Heck, most of the "Catholic" blogosphere is filled with pro-war zealots whose writing might endear them to Neuhaus but wouldn't even get the courtesy of a rejection letter L'Observatorio Romano or Civilta Catolica. I give Mr. Alexander credit for what he has done here and recognizing this for what it is.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-70420533019657795292008-05-14T13:34:00.000-04:002008-05-14T13:34:00.000-04:00...and weren't getting mentioned in the print medi...<I>...and weren't getting mentioned in the print media, including the ones you mention. That was my point.</I><BR/><BR/>Well, perhaps that's a good thing. Not every blogger covets the limelight and no blogger <I>should</I>; some, when the spotlight is thrust upon them, hold up better than others. <BR/><BR/><I>That the medium of blogging, specifically Catholic blogging, was in such an embryonic stage at the time, that someone without that background could not garner that distinction, was another point I was making.</I><BR/><BR/>True and agreed. Honestly, I'm extremely skeptical of those who try to "make a living" from blogging or make their audience feel it is incumbent on them to provide them a paycheck. Even St. Paul made tents, or so I'm told.<BR/><BR/><I>There are a some significant new players in the Catholic blogosphere. I wrote at some length on one of them.</I><BR/><BR/>We seem to share similar tastes.<BR/><BR/><I>There is also a significant increase in the role of "niche blogs." </I><BR/><BR/>Exactly -- I think some figured out not everybody could do (or saw the pointlessness in offering) "all news, all the time", figured out what <BR/>they are particularly good at, and stuck to it. (This is what I was getting at with my 'NOVA documentary on PBS documentary or C-SPAN vs. Larry King" illustration). I think there are also those news-bloggers or Catholic apologists who overreach, expounding on topics (usually geopolitical) they have little familiarity with. <BR/><BR/><I>This indicates to me the demand for this sort of discussion on an otherwise arcane topic, that nonetheless affects the average Catholic at a fundamental level.</I><BR/><BR/>Agreed.Christopher Blosserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08385159494196923575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-65780758818589110442008-05-14T11:50:00.000-04:002008-05-14T11:50:00.000-04:00Christopher:Yours was not a bad analysis, cogent i...Christopher:<BR/><BR/>Yours was not a bad analysis, cogent in some respects, missing the boat in others. I'll try to be brief. You also have to remember that this was written a year ago, as a commentary on the status quo as of TWO years ago. This is a long time in this medium. There have been some changes in the landscape, and in the characteristics of readership, since then. But here goes: <BR/><BR/><I>"How many bloggers do you know who actually fit this stereotype? -- Name them."</I><BR/><BR/>There's not enough time. And no, they don't all do it, but many of the more popular ones deign to be the next Erma Bombeck, not that I blame them.<BR/><BR/><I>"...and I bet you can also do some exploring and find a good number number among those 1,400+ registered Catholic blogs that post substantial content..."</I><BR/><BR/>...and weren't getting mentioned in the print media, including the ones you mention. That was my point.<BR/><BR/><I>"Case in point, I was for one particularly glad to see Amy Welborn's voice on the contributing panel..."</I><BR/><BR/>You mean <I>hear</I> her voice, right?<BR/><BR/>Yes, she's excellent, and in listening to her during the interregnum following the death of John Paul II, I thought she brought a lot to the table. But she also had an established reputation in the print media before blogging. Were it not for the former, it is unlikely you would have seen her on television. That the medium of blogging, specifically Catholic blogging, was in such an embryonic stage at the time, that someone without that background could not garner that distinction, was another point I was making.<BR/><BR/><I>"...though I grant some validity to your criticisms, I'm not ready to pronounce an indictment."</I><BR/><BR/>The intention was analysis, not criticism. That a medium is in its early stages is nobody's fault. That its early luminaries are crossovers from previous conventional media (similar to radio personalities in the early days of television) is also nobody's fault. It is the way such media evolves. In a more recent analysis, I remarked on the changes that had taken place just within the last year. There are a some significant new players in the Catholic blogosphere. I wrote at some length on one of them. Click <A HREF="http://manwithblackhat.blogspot.com/2008/02/if-nominated-i-will-not-run-and-if.html" REL="nofollow">here</A>.<BR/><BR/>There is also a significant increase in the role of "niche blogs." One of them, Father Zuhlsdorf's <I>What Does The Prayer Really Say?</I>, won most of the CBA categories this year. This indicates to me the demand for this sort of discussion on an otherwise arcane topic, that nonetheless affects the average Catholic at a fundamental level.<BR/><BR/>All told, "some validity" is good enough for me.David L Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-40670330124449001572008-05-14T11:13:00.000-04:002008-05-14T11:13:00.000-04:00Actually, I did recall that post, but I'll respond...Actually, I did recall that post, but I'll respond to your points.<BR/><BR/>#1 <I>To that end, I don't exactly fit the "Roman Catholic poster child" mold. No, I don't mean that I'm a sinner and others are not. That's beside the point. I don't have that fresh-shaven face and button-down demeanor, with an adorable, devoted wife and five or six obedient children wearing matching outfits.</I><BR/><BR/>How many bloggers do you know who actually fit this stereotype? -- Name them.<BR/><BR/>Count me skeptical, but if all the popular bloggers had to rely on were sharing stories of "loading the kiddies into the van for soccer games, or staying up nights to watch the youngest one with a cold", I doubt there would be that many reading them. <BR/><BR/><I>I don't jump on every story that hits the Catholic blogosphere within the same news cycle. Don't ask me how, but others have time for that. There appears to be a demand for posting links to a dozen stories a day and connecting them to clever witticisms, and doing that day after day.</I><BR/><BR/>I admit this does characterize a specific kind of blog and blogging style which has an understandable appeal. There are about 3-4 secular political blogs/sites that I skim daily for a grasp of the news and world-happenings. There are likewise about that many Catholic blogs that I skim during my lunch break to catch up on the news and political events from a distinctly Catholic perspective. <BR/><BR/>These kind of bloggers tend to vary in quality / quantity -- for example, your description captures both <I>Pro Ecclesia</I> and <I>Catholic & Enjoying It</I>, at least in terms of covering the news cycle on a daily bsis, but IMHO there is one that distinguishes itself to me as commenting with greater clarity and substance.<BR/><BR/>You claim that:<BR/><BR/><I>... try to find an article on "Catholic blogs" that does not mention the same one or two individuals (and you know who you are, dahhh-lings!)</I><BR/><BR/>and I bet you can also do some exploring and find a good number number among those 1,400+ registered Catholic blogs that post substantial content, host the occasional stimulating discussions and garner a readership of its own. <BR/><BR/>(From my own reading list: <I>Pontifications</I>, <I>What's Wrong with the World</I>, <I>Sacramentum Vitae</I>, <I>New Liturgical Movement</I>, <I>Caelum Et Terra</I>, <I>DarwinCatholic</I>, <I>Rerum Novarum</I> ... -- all of which seem to get by and develop a following w/o feeling obligated to reference the "dahhh-lings". <BR/><BR/>Granted, they don't boast the same quantity of readers -- I suspect for the same reason that a NOVA documentary on PBS or an academic lecture on C-Span doesn't get the same number of viewers as Nightline or Larry King, but I'm not necessarily going to hold the latter in resentment for their popular appeal. <BR/><BR/>If some Catholic bloggers with a knack for bringing Catholic analysis to daily news and events get a mention in the secular/mainstream press, I'm not necessarily going to begrudge them. <BR/><BR/>Case in point, I was for one particularly glad to see Amy Welborn's voice on the contributing panel of <I>New York Times</I>' coverage for Benedict's visit to the U.S.; she has distinguished herself as one capable of presenting the Faith with clarity to a popular audience and countering the misrepresentations of the secular and often anti-Catholic press -- yet in a way doesn't come across as beating somebody over the head with a bat. Which is also why I think readers appreciate her. <BR/><BR/><I>My point -- and it is my ONLY point -- is that one cannot claim the internet has come on its own as a tool for getting the Catholic message across. ..</I><BR/><BR/>The "dahhh-lings" you reference are in fact only a subset of Catholic bloggers, which is in themselves a subset of the myriad vehicles for "getting the Catholic message across" on the internet -- which is why, though I grant some validity to your criticisms, I'm not ready to pronounce an indictment.Christopher Blosserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08385159494196923575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-50279782299925197962008-05-14T08:58:00.000-04:002008-05-14T08:58:00.000-04:00"[P]erhaps the same readers will take this as an o...<I>"[P]erhaps the same readers will take this as an opportunity to broaden their horizons and explore other venues, online or even offline."</I><BR/><BR/>Christopher, you obviously haven't read <A HREF="http://manwithblackhat.blogspot.com/2007/02/for-your-hah-consideration.html" REL="nofollow">this</A>.<BR/><BR/>Read items 1 and 5, then get back to me.David L Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-46806254530707939642008-05-13T23:37:00.000-04:002008-05-13T23:37:00.000-04:00On one hand, I hear what David's saying about 'Cat...On one hand, I hear what David's saying about 'Catholic celebrity worship' and agree for the most part, especially about putting young converts in the spotlight as bastions of orthodoxy or hold them to a standard of perfection. <BR/><BR/>That said -- I'm hesitant to dismiss the "regulars" over at the-blog-formerly-known-as-"the cafeteria is closed" as idolators or goggle-eyed celebrity-worshippers. <BR/><BR/>I think most gravitate to the 'popular Catholic blogs'' not necessarily to worship the author but for the stimulating discussions they generate. Gerald had a knack for pulling together some interesting topics; likewise Amy Welborn, likewise Mark Shea (to name two other popular venues). <BR/><BR/>I don't count myself as a regular reader, but from what I see those that are expressing their concerned are in large part simply disappointed or expressing concern that a Catholic blogger would publicly stray from the teachings of Mother Church. They may then make an effort to reason with him or point out his error and if that fails, they may decide to sever their links in the interest of not promoting error. <BR/><BR/>Of course, uou also have those who behave like a virtual lynch mob, ready to burn at the stake -- methinks all their screaming actually plays into Gerald's hands, as -- despite his ability to police his own combox -- he has conveniently let them rant, and proceeded to characterized his critics <I>en masse</I> as <A HREF="http://vox-nova.com/2008/04/04/two-round-center-mass/#comment-17649" REL="nofollow">"pitchfork-wielding mobs"</A> who wish to <A HREF="http://vox-nova.com/2008/04/04/two-round-center-mass/#comment-17736" REL="nofollow">"burn you at the stake"</A> -- bypassing the rational arguments that have been advanced. <BR/> <BR/>On the other hand, given as there are 1,408 Catholic blogs registered today, perhaps the same readers will take this as an opportunity to broaden their horizons and explore other venues, online or even offline.Christopher Blosserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08385159494196923575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-36225393848792851092008-05-13T10:06:00.000-04:002008-05-13T10:06:00.000-04:00Perhaps if we stopped acting like these people wer...Perhaps if we stopped acting like these people were celebrities, we would solve half of these issues. I could ask my mother or grandmother their opinions of the usual suspects, and they would just shrug their shoulders. Only a handful of 'popular' blogs have enough readership to be considered a decent sized parish. A lot of people seem to care about GA, and I'm sure he enjoys to a degree his little following. My goodness though. Should people really be getting worked up about a guy with a blog in California? I don't know about you, but I don't have to look very far to find sympathy for those with homosexual tendencies. And yes, his opinion is wrong, but so what? A person on the Internet is wrong. Who would have thunk it? Perhaps if these folks weren't so utterly devoid of actual communion at a parish, they might stop making idols of bloggers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-25980252938474529122008-05-12T10:00:00.000-04:002008-05-12T10:00:00.000-04:00Gerald Augustinus is an open public heretic.He sho...Gerald Augustinus is an open public heretic.<BR/>He should be censured for his dissent,excommunicated if he fails to recant.<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>Dominic.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-45140437754552748002008-05-11T23:20:00.000-04:002008-05-11T23:20:00.000-04:00This should keep me thinking for a while.This should keep me thinking for a while.Joe of St. Thérèsehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06506671882770822003noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-28083977078821888372008-05-11T22:15:00.000-04:002008-05-11T22:15:00.000-04:00"get over ourselves." ... and keep praying."get over ourselves." ... and keep praying.Candlestringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15648193938875923815noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-17882292127644366862008-05-11T22:08:00.000-04:002008-05-11T22:08:00.000-04:00"Can you imagine what would happen if the Archbish...<I>"Can you imagine what would happen if the Archbishop demanded public penance from Ted Kennedy or one of the other pro-abort pols?"</I><BR/><BR/>No, I can't. His desire to maintain the status quo only means he's a product of the same culture that produced the rest of us. We are all enamored with public notice. There is a great temptation to appease it, in order to retain our own sense of status. Doing the right thing is hard, because it runs the risk of being uninvited to the cool kids' table.<BR/><BR/>A lot of us in the Catholic blogosphere have the same problem, or you-know-who wouldn't have tried to pull off you-know-what.David L Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13871706129906941567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-6646916509214988282008-05-11T22:01:00.000-04:002008-05-11T22:01:00.000-04:00Can you imagine what would happen if the Archbisho...Can you imagine what would happen if the Archbishop demanded public penance from Ted Kennedy or one of the other pro-abort pols?<BR/><BR/>Can you imagine if he actually did it? What a sign that would be?<BR/><BR/>Where is the St. Ambrose of today? St. Louis maybe...Patrick Archboldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13230114519933936165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-84710232338438947662008-05-11T02:46:00.000-04:002008-05-11T02:46:00.000-04:00Excellent post David. I also made a comparison bet...Excellent post David. <BR/><BR/>I also made a comparison between Archbishop Wuerl & St. Ambrose http://custosfidei.blogspot.com/2008/04/archbishop-wuerl-is-no-st-ambrose.html<BR/><BR/>I have struggled with how I want to present my blog as a Catholic. At first I was acerbic and quite effective in my postings with this style. But the more I learned about my faith the more I understood that my method wasn't the 'best' way to be a witness to Christ.<BR/><BR/>Thus I gradually changed my style and mode in order to represent the message of Jesus. I've lost a lot of readers but I gained much as well.<BR/><BR/>Your posting reminded me of my journey at some levels. I could have easily continued to be acerbic, sarcastic, and hard-hitting, but I chose not to. Even at the expense of losing readers. I'm not perfect, but I am trying.<BR/><BR/>Nonetheless I believe you hit the nail right on the head and I hope the Gerald understands that he has an unusual influence that will lead many astray, most especially himself.<BR/><BR/>In Jesus, Mary, & Joseph,<BR/><BR/>TitoTito Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12218771096085701665noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3589378.post-69423667182748331212008-05-10T21:20:00.000-04:002008-05-10T21:20:00.000-04:00Very good post with lots to think about.Very good post with lots to think about.Subvethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13523683273450353313noreply@blogger.com